Yeast die-off
We changed our boy’s constipation to diarrhea by increasing to fulldose of Glycolax, increasing magnesium, and serving potato more oftenand rice less. We found a balance finally, but kept him on the runnyside because he was still straining (even though no more bricks). Weassume it’s gas pains. We’d taken 3-4 weeks to get to this point.Things were stable.
About 4 days ago we tried to add a yeast kill protocol that anotherparent wrote she had success with. We tried to use No fenol and 1hour later, a few drops of GSE. We did this only one time per day forthree days.
Now Seth has worse diarrhea like water. This has been going on for2-3 days now. It was so bad today, that Seth’s teacher called andsaid it ran down his pants into his shoes, so he had to be taken homefrom school early (or stay there with no shoes). My wife thought weshould cut back on No Fenol and GSE. I said, no. Cut back on Glycolax.
Was the yeast causing the constipation, and can the very waterydiarrhea therefore indicate yeast is dead or dying? Have other’sexperienced this, or is our boy unique? Should we suspect somethingelse caused the change? Would it be a good idea to continue the yeastkill protocol indefinitely, and slowly cut out the Glycolax? I’venoticed a bit more congition since the No Phenol / GSE routine.
This post tagged as: magnesium, fenol, diarrhea
Wesley Marske said,
Wrote on April 26, 2007 @ 10:18 am
Just a word of caution. You should never start more than one thing ata time. The GSE in particular should be started with only 1 drop diluted injuice or water. Some children react badly to these interventions just as theymay react to certain foods. I am in the proccess of starting a yeast protocol. I have had my son on very limited phenol for a week now. and Epsom salt bathsstarting with only 1/3 c salts in the bath and working up to 1 c. I am nowready to start the GSE and I will only use 1 drop per dose for the first day x 2doses. You need at least a few days to see if there is any reaction to thesethings. I prefer to wait a week between changes. It is better to take it slowthan to overdo it. The biomedical approach is a marathon not a race. Sorry if it sounds like a lecture. I ran into a problem way back in the first2 months of starting the diet because a DAN naturopath recommended a whole slewof supplements at once and caused a backslide in Connor’s progress. I have beentaking it really slow ever since and have not regretted it. We are in our 18thmonth of the diet and Connor has made a remarkable and steady progress.
Theodora Formato said,
Wrote on April 26, 2007 @ 4:16 pm
I guess the No Phenol and GSE are pretty potent stuff, orat least more than I realized.
Melisa Schumpert said,
Wrote on April 27, 2007 @ 9:09 am
This sounds like there was no yeast, and the GSE caused a bad bacteriaproblem. Drop the GSE and add lots of probiotics. Culturelle canwork well for this.
I would cut back on all but the No-Fenol, which will keep yeast awaybut not contribute to bad bacteria overgrowth.
Yep, this is experienced quite often, once the yeast is gone.
Stop the yeast “kill” protocol and start a yeast “maintenance”protocol with lots of probiotics. Start a bacteria protocol if thebacteria [diarrhea] is not gone within a few days with just probiotics.
I would personally cut back the Glycolax or entirely eliminate it.
Theodora Formato said,
Wrote on April 29, 2007 @ 6:19 am
This is hard because you see, about a month ago Seth was strugglingwith megarectum BM’s. 3-4 inches wide hard clay. It’s a verydelicate balance with the glycolax. We feel strongly that if weremove it, it’s back to the clay bricks. Seth still strains, his GIsays, because autistic kids remember pain more. (I don’t know - ormaybe it’s gas?).
But the watery stuff running into his shoes, and him waking up in apuddle of dripping stench, is also unbearable.
So you can understand why we would rather not cut out ALL theyGlycolax. However I think we should cut it in half, and cut out theGSE per your suggestion. So you are saying that the bad bacteria iscausing diarrhea, then? Just wondering how certain you are, or ifthis is speculation, since I’ve read the opposite of clostridium.
Melisa Schumpert said,
Wrote on April 29, 2007 @ 5:40 pm
I had one of those once. EFAs caused it [EFAs pull magnesium forabsorption]. Nasty thing!
What about if you just reduce the dose, and see what happens? I cancertainly understand why you don’t want to go back to the nasty bm!
Watery diarrhea running into the shoes, can be bad bacteria, or it canbe diarrhea slipping around an impaction. Have you had an x-ray forimpaction?
Is he waking up into a puddle of urine/bm, or sweat? If sweat, hemight not tolerate the GSE.
Try that, see if it helps.
Bad bacteria caused nasty diarrhea for my son.
It is my son’s exact experience when I gave him GSE after the yeastwas already gone. Your son’s experience might be different tho.
Theodora Formato said,
Wrote on April 29, 2007 @ 7:46 pm
This was occuring for a year, even before we introduced any EFAs. Wedidn’t get help because it was on again off again, and because wedidn’t know anyone could help (obviously not the pediatrician). Whenwe finally saw a GI (which took a couple months) he just said “up theglycolax and remove rice, apples and bananas”.
Yes we have started doing this. Also as you said we cut out the GSE,and are about to start probiotics (I’ve got to order some tomorrow).
We suspected this before because his clay brick always had diarrheaaround it, and because of what we’ve read. However he’s been in adiarrhea state for a month. We took an xray last week and there wasnothing noteworthy. The puddle he was waking up in was waterydiarrhea. Gross as can be. Leaks out everywhere. Today he hadanother diarrhea but it wasn’t quite as bad. Cutting out the GSEseems to have firmed things up a little.
OK. I have no reservations believing it. Should we try to fight thebacteria? He’s NEVER had antibiotics - I don’t want to use themunless it’s life or death. Probiotics are the key it looks like.
OK. Thank you very much again.
Melisa Schumpert said,
Wrote on April 30, 2007 @ 8:50 am
Well, rice, apples, and bananas are constipating. So is milk. So Iagree with removing those things and see if it helps. Also increasemagnesium and vitamin C. If that does not help, consider otherthings, like yeast overgrowth. Other ideas here
http://www.danasview.net/constip.htm
Great! Then it was probably a bad bacteria overgrowth issue, at leastit would have been for my son.
Probiotics, especially Culturelle. I use olive leaf extract ifprobiotics don’t help as much or as quickly as I want.
Mark S said,
Wrote on December 26, 2007 @ 11:52 pm
Well I found this story here posted about myself but my name is not “Theodora Formato”. Anyway I wanted to follow up with the history of this, that about 1-2 months after this was written I started to supplement Seth with butyrate (since his levels were always low on stool tests) and that really made his BM’s normal for the first time. He was potty trained immediately. No more constipation or diarrhea. He has been happily on this regimen for about 2 years now. If he gets too much sugar in one day though he will start falling down and spinning and stuff again. Yeast? I don’t know.